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Barry
Joined: 07 Jul 2010
Posts: 95
Location: London England
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 Posted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 7:22 am Post subject: Snow Flake Framing |
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How Do All 
Can anyone tell me if using 6mm (1/4") Carbon tube framing for a Hexagon Snowflake kite would be strong enough / light enough or would I need to go for heavier 8mm (5/16") Carbon tube or lighter 5mm (3/16")?
The kite will be made from Three 750mm squares, Six 500mm squares and Six 250mm squares, giving an outside radius of about 530mm, so each perimeter stick will be about 530mm.
Also would the same size tube be ok for the centre spine, or would this need to be a larger or smaller size, than the framing?
Thank you in advance for your advice.
Take care,
Barry
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Barry Brown.
Rope & Canvas Craftsman.
Practical Works of Art,
Inspired by Tradition.
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/ropeandcanvas
http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/Knotty.Bear |
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DTH1
Joined: 13 Mar 2008
Posts: 662
Location: Dubbo, Australia
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| Posted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 7:35 am Post subject: |
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Hi Barry,
I used 6mm fibreglass spars for mine - 900mm/600mm/300mm
So 6mm Carbon will be plenty for yours.
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Cheers
David
Keep The Dream Alive
(Hit the Snooze Buttton) |
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mototrev
Kitebuilder of the Year 2010
Joined: 31 Jan 2009
Posts: 1518
Location: Melbourne, Australia.
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| Posted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 7:39 am Post subject: |
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I would have thought 6mm would be ok! maybe even 5mm at only 530mm length
I used 4.4 mm dowel on one with 250mm sticks.....hasn't broken yet.
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Trev-(R)
As my wife often says: "Trev- Go fly a kite! |
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mototrev
Kitebuilder of the Year 2010
Joined: 31 Jan 2009
Posts: 1518
Location: Melbourne, Australia.
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| Posted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 7:40 am Post subject: |
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Doh! And he said pumpkin was quick!
| DTH1 wrote: | .
Dang Pumpkin's quick!! |
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Trev-(R)
As my wife often says: "Trev- Go fly a kite!
Last edited by mototrev on Fri Jul 30, 2010 8:23 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Pumpkin
Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 7778
Location: Birmingham UK
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| Posted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 8:15 am Post subject: |
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| mototrev wrote: | | Doh! And he said pumpkin was quick! |
What have I done now   
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Pete
Where did you say the string goes? |
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Barry
Joined: 07 Jul 2010
Posts: 95
Location: London England
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| Posted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 8:27 am Post subject: |
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Cheers for the quick replies, much appreciated 
900 x 600 x 300mm that looks like a good size to play with, and the sticks I have already are long enough to accomodate, I think I may borrow your figures and up-size 
Thanks again.
Take care,
Barry
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Barry Brown.
Rope & Canvas Craftsman.
Practical Works of Art,
Inspired by Tradition.
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/ropeandcanvas
http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/Knotty.Bear |
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powder_pig
Master Kite Builder
Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 5489
Location: Portland, OR, AKA Region 9
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| Posted: Fri Jul 30, 2010 3:00 pm Post subject: |
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My snowflake I built with just 1/4" wooden dowels and I have flown it for two years without a mishap.
And it is about the same size.
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Ron
It's sunny and windy in the summer and cold and snowy in the winter...this must be what heaven is like. |
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Barry
Joined: 07 Jul 2010
Posts: 95
Location: London England
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| Posted: Sat Jul 31, 2010 10:51 am Post subject: |
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How Do All
Cheers for popping in the picture Ron, it really is a sweet looking kite
I am just waiting for some more rsn and then I can get busy with it.
Take care,
Barry
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Barry Brown.
Rope & Canvas Craftsman.
Practical Works of Art,
Inspired by Tradition.
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/ropeandcanvas
http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/Knotty.Bear |
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Barry
Joined: 07 Jul 2010
Posts: 95
Location: London England
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| Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2010 1:05 pm Post subject: |
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How Do All
I noticed whilst looking through some of Ron's pictures that there was a drawing showing the centre of the snowflake seamed into a 3 part tubular sleeve for the centre spar to go through rather than having extra tapes sewn into the seam with the spar running in one of the vee's created.
this is where I saw the picture:
http://entertainment.webshots.com/photo/2759405780103872790GerpdV
Is that the normal way of doing the centre of the snowflake rather than having seperate tapes sewn on as in the #54 Star, and if the sleeve approach was used would you need to have 3 tension lines on each end of the sleeve, one for each of the 3 parts of the sleeve?
Sorry if this seems like a dumb question but it was hard to see how Ron did it on his Snowflake in the pictures.
Can you shed any light on how you did this part of your kite Ron?
Thanks in advance for any help, comments, Idea's.
Take care,
Barry
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Barry Brown.
Rope & Canvas Craftsman.
Practical Works of Art,
Inspired by Tradition.
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/ropeandcanvas
http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/Knotty.Bear |
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powder_pig
Master Kite Builder
Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 5489
Location: Portland, OR, AKA Region 9
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| Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2010 2:45 pm Post subject: |
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This is how I sewed the center.
Three pieces laid on top of each other and sewed with a 1/2" tunnel. Look closely at the three colors of the fabric in the center. Red, Green and Blue. It's alot simpler than the other diagram.
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Ron
It's sunny and windy in the summer and cold and snowy in the winter...this must be what heaven is like. |
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planish
Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 3544
Location: Canada, New Brunswick, Sackville
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| Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2010 5:05 am Post subject: |
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| powder_pig wrote: | This is how I sewed the center.
[snip]
Three pieces laid on top of each other and sewed with a 1/2" tunnel. Look closely at the three colors of the fabric in the center. Red, Green and Blue. It's alot simpler than the other diagram. |
Squint as I may, I cannot see a tunnel. 
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- John Rose -
In progress: Houndstooth pattern applique for Ohashi variant.
ToDo list: small Rok, hand shadow bird applique; Marilyn Monroe portrait kite; another One-Piece Cody; Dave Wadeson's "Mouse"; Manga Multiconos line laundry; Supersled or Pilot lifter.
Stalled: Cowboy Bebop's "Ed" Ohashi Variant |
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powder_pig
Master Kite Builder
Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 5489
Location: Portland, OR, AKA Region 9
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| Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2010 5:44 am Post subject: |
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Three layers with a 1/2" tunnel. At the joining point, I made two sewn lines that joined the three pieces together. The space between the two lines, 1/2" apart or whatever space you need to accommodate the spar you are using, is the tunnel.
Pretty simple.
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Ron
It's sunny and windy in the summer and cold and snowy in the winter...this must be what heaven is like. |
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Barry
Joined: 07 Jul 2010
Posts: 95
Location: London England
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| Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2010 6:20 am Post subject: |
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How Do All
Thanks so much for the extra info Ron ; It all makes perfect sense now
I have to admit I did wonder how you made a 3 part sleeve when your darker colour seemed to bisect the kite 
I like method you used, it is deceptively simple, very clean looking, and will be a lot easier to mark out and sew than making a 3 part sleeve.
Thanks again for your help.
Take care,
Barry
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Barry Brown.
Rope & Canvas Craftsman.
Practical Works of Art,
Inspired by Tradition.
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/ropeandcanvas
http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/Knotty.Bear |
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snowykite
Joined: 08 Feb 2005
Posts: 2154
Location: Oxford England
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| Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2010 8:27 am Post subject: |
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Thats the method I used on my flake 15 years ago (the first kite I made) and it's still going strong (and it's sewn with coats thread).
Also sewed the loops for the arrow knocks on the same lines.
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Trevor
Growing old is compulsory
Growing up is optional
All knowledge is useful, you just dont know when
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planish
Joined: 19 Aug 2008
Posts: 3544
Location: Canada, New Brunswick, Sackville
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| Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2010 10:53 pm Post subject: |
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| powder_pig wrote: | Pretty simple.
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Ah, yes., very simple. As am I.
I suppose you could even say that it doesn't really need a tunnel. I would think that just a loop/tab near the middle should do the trick, if you don't mind an exposed longeron. The tunnel would be more symmetrical though.
_________________
- John Rose -
In progress: Houndstooth pattern applique for Ohashi variant.
ToDo list: small Rok, hand shadow bird applique; Marilyn Monroe portrait kite; another One-Piece Cody; Dave Wadeson's "Mouse"; Manga Multiconos line laundry; Supersled or Pilot lifter.
Stalled: Cowboy Bebop's "Ed" Ohashi Variant |
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Barry
Joined: 07 Jul 2010
Posts: 95
Location: London England
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| Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 8:35 pm Post subject: Cosmic Debris Snow Flake! |
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How Do All
(I have copied this post to the other topics I started about this build, sorry for all the re-posts, I should have done this all in one topic )
I finished my Yeterday and have been fiddling with the tensioning today, I think it is good to go bar a few wrinkles maybe they will iron out  I think maybe the major tension points need a little more tension.
I think the colours work well but I would like to see the kite in day light now.
I made a matching silver bag for it too,
I originally had it set up with split rings but I think they looked out of place and are not easy to set the tension with so I went for what I do best; cord and knots, easy on the eye and easy to change the tension.
I hope to fly it tomorrow so will get some better pictures .
Take care,
Barry
_________________
Barry Brown.
Rope & Canvas Craftsman.
Practical Works of Art,
Inspired by Tradition.
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/ropeandcanvas
http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/Knotty.Bear |
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shamrok
Joined: 20 Dec 2004
Posts: 713
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| Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 9:59 pm Post subject: |
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"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It's a waste of time, and it annoys the pig." |
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powder_pig
Master Kite Builder
Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 5489
Location: Portland, OR, AKA Region 9
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| Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 10:31 pm Post subject: |
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looks great, Barry.
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Ron
It's sunny and windy in the summer and cold and snowy in the winter...this must be what heaven is like. |
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Barry
Joined: 07 Jul 2010
Posts: 95
Location: London England
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| Posted: Sat Aug 14, 2010 10:13 am Post subject: |
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How do all
cheers
I am pretty happy with the way it turned out,
the 6mm Carbon tube framing is plenty stiff, and I think I could have gone 5mm and still been plenty strong enough.
I will now call this thread finished with; and post any new pictures and details in the thread found here to save forum space.
http://www.kitebuilder.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=9177&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
Take care,
Barry
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Barry Brown.
Rope & Canvas Craftsman.
Practical Works of Art,
Inspired by Tradition.
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/ropeandcanvas
http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/Knotty.Bear |
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Gill Bloom
Joined: 21 Feb 2006
Posts: 277
Location: Great Horkesley UK
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| Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 1:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Looks good, |
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