Kitebuilder.com

[Steve D]

Afternoon y'all.

I've gotten the itch lately to give fighter kite building a try. Have done a bit of reading of materials on the web and need to get some of the stuff in print and on CD as well.

From the information I've read, I see that the favored matrials for the spines are bamboo and flat Carbon. I can see how bamboo would be desirable - its strong, light, holds a bend well, is fairly durable and is fairly inexpensive. Carbon is also strong, light and durable but needs a tensioner of some sort across the spine to hold the desired bend and is a bit more expensive.

For you folks building and flying fighters...What would be my benefit from using flat Carbon for the spine instead of bamboo? Also, does anyone have a link to a good description with some photos of one of the spine tensioners some folks make that uses a glass bead as the adjustment point?

[KiteSquid]

I dont build many fighters (only one so far) but the advatnages I see of Carbon over bamboo is uniformany and stability.

Carbon is engineered and there is not much diffrence between peices, but every bamboo pole is diffrent.

Carbon does not deform if you get it wet.

insects dont eat Carbon fiber, yet...

There is a skill to forming Bamboo that I dont think I want to expend the effort to learn...

But bamboo is a lot cheeper. I asked a farmer in my area that has a BIG patch of it and he told me to cut all I want!!!!!!

I have about 30 poles quartered and ageing in my garage rafters...

I have not seen any of the glass bead tensoniers you are refering to. Hve you looked in Bruce Lambert's new CD based book? How about the NAFKA book or the one by Philippe Gallot?
_________________
VR/
KiteSquid
AKA TakoIka
AKA Harold
King George VA


P.S. Yet another post by the Squid..... Doesent he ever shut up???

P.P.S. The wind is like the air, only pushier.

[Spence602]

I've built a few fighters (30 or more) - all my outdoor one's have bamboo spines.

I think there's 2 advantages of bamboo over flat CF.
1) Bamboo is far less expensive. If I break a bamboo spine, it doesn't hurt. I (used to) buy them in bundles of 25 or so.
2) Bamboo will hold a 'bend' where ever you want it (by heating it, bending it, and letting it cool - all before you glue it onto the skin). Bamboo will also hold a 'field adjustment' (bending it over your head or the like) for a while (depending upon conditions). For flat CF, unless you put in multiple connection points along the spine (drill new holes), the only adjustment you can make is to either give it more bow or give it less bow. You can't move the bending point.

I like to cut out a couple skins for the same kite, and bend the bamboo slightly differently in each one, or use a different strength spine. Usually the main bend is about an inch above the horizontal line that goes through both tips. Sometimes I also put another small bend about an inch from the nose. That helps it pull out of a dive, but it also allows some LE pressure to bleed off for higher winds.

If you order some spines from Bruce, you'll have to 'work' them a little bit (i.e. straighten some of them out) before you can use them.

I could keep typing, but it's late and I'm beat.
_________________
Spence
www.kiteshark.org

Air: Refreshing when stirred up and served cool on a hot day.

[Stan]

Good post, Spence!

The only additions I'd make is that you can taper bamboo so the strength is in the middle and the curve is static, where a flat Carbon multipoint bridle changes slightly in flight while the extra bridle legs add drag.

That said, some champion fliers use drilled flat Carbon with many bridle points, but it's very demanding to get right. Others use round Carbon spines but the bow tends to wander from side to side.

I make dozens of spars at a sitting, and since they all are slightly different, I can select them to suit different kite designs as I make them.
The variations in bamboo spars are part of their appeal.

Gloves or thick tape on your fingers are a must.

Harold, I have yet to have insects nibble one of hundreds of bamboo spars. Must be an east coast species.

Bamboo Stan

[KiteSquid]

I was reading some stuff about bamboo a few years ago and they talked about pests and that you should cut your bamboo in the winter because it has a better chance of drying without getting bugs in it....


While in Japan I was given a 1 meter section of a rafter out of a home that was torn down.....

What should I do with it????

I dont know how to work it and am afraid of messing up a 100 year old piece of smoked bamboo.
_________________
VR/
KiteSquid
AKA TakoIka
AKA Harold
King George VA


P.S. Yet another post by the Squid..... Doesent he ever shut up???

P.P.S. The wind is like the air, only pushier.

[Stan]

I'm not in that crowd.. don't kitemaking competitions allow you to use natural materials? Get some washi, a tatami and hapi coat and you're all set to make genuine kites with soul.
It really is fun to fly something made of plants.

Stan

[Spence602]

Squid: There are a lot of fighterkite folks putting kites they made up on eBay, with the profits donated to the AKA. You could give Bruce Lambert a jingle and see what he thinks a meter of 'smoked' would go for...

(I'll bet he makes you an offer.)

Just a thought...
_________________
Spence
www.kiteshark.org

Air: Refreshing when stirred up and served cool on a hot day.

[Spence602]

Just to clarify - some additional thoughts:

[Spence602]

I finished the Silhouette last night, and tried to take it for a 'spin' today. Not enough wind at the subdivision park (too many houses around).

The Kula was on my 'to do' list for a while. The other Silhouette skin is still on the table...



_________________
Spence
www.kiteshark.org

Air: Refreshing when stirred up and served cool on a hot day.

[KiteSquid]