Kitebuilder.com

[woodpekr]

Hi,

I have some 3M 9460 tape that's probably a year or so old. It doesn't seem to stick like it used to.

I taped two pieces of scrap Ripstop together , burnished the connection and let it sit for a day. I can peel the connection apart fairly easily. Pulling on the pieces laterally seems to be strong but I didn't pull as hard as I could have either.

Thanks -- Rich
_________________
Rich Durant
Portland, Oregon

[wdrwilson]

I have some that I bought last year around this time, it's still going strong. I have a new roll and I will try and compare the two. I keep it in a ziploc bag in a dark drawer.. but that's about it.

--Bill

[Dorsal]

3M's pdf data sheet on the 9460 tape says the shelf life is 24 months at 70 deg.F and 50% humidity. Now, if there was only some way to know the date of manufacture from a single roll of tape, you might be able to gauge some sense of how much of the shelf life was left.
Personally, unless I was using it for a "no-sew" kind of kite, I wouldn't worry about it. Normally, the stuff is just there to keep the pieces aligned long enough to get the sail under the foot of my sewing machine. After it's sewn, I wish it would completely disappear, as it seems to attract bits of sand from beaches that are over 50 miles away.

[CJQ]

Hi Rich , I have some tape that is probably 3 yr's old. I keep it on a shelf in my kite room un protected . I use it perodicaly and seems to work ok. I burnish real hard anyway. Some people set it with mild heat . that will accelerate the bonding. Thes may improve your results.

CLIFF

[robkite]

Rich, I went to the mountain to consult the guru Sam Huston and here is his reply.

Rob, asking me for one answer is like turning on a fire hose to fill the
teapot.

1. Service life of the VHB adhesive in 9460 is 50 years. Old is no problem

2. One day is not long enough to wait without applying heat. At ambient
temperature it takes like 3 days to reach complete bond on a smooth, high
activity surface such as aluminum - an uncertain amount longer on a woven
fabric surface as the goo has to flow further to get into the weaving grain.
Raising temperature to something over 100F speeds it up a bunch, but 150F
causes severe fabric distortion. Careful use of a clothes iron with a Teflon
shoe works very well.

3. Nylon has a lower "surface activity" (think grabbing power) than
polyester, e.g. nylon is closer to Teflon than polyester. Polyester in sheet
form (Mylar) is right up there with aluminum.

4. All acrylic adhesives (9460 is a great one) are way stronger in shear
load than in peel. You can handle limited peeling angle in lightly loaded
joints, like fastening the wings to the center cells of a Tri-D Box, but
right angle joints are doomed.

5. 1/4" wide strip joints are not as strong as the fabric. You can always
pull them apart if you try hard enough. Strong enough for 10 years service
in some favorite kites though.

I have settled down on polyester fabric & shear load applications with good
success. I like Icarex better than the Softer Toray because the surface
looks smoother, but have never done any testing to prove anything. Also use
#9469 instead of 9460 on the coarser weave of 3.9 oz. Dacron. It is the same
as 9460 except 5 mils thick instead of 2. Have not tested the newer melamine
impregnated nylons like NorthCloth. Settled down on polyester 10 years ago
and haven't looked back.

The clues on curing times and the value of heating the adhesive came from a
3M service rep at a tape distributor place (R.S. Hughes Co.) one day when I
was buying tape.

cheers, Sam
_________________
Robkite
Rob Pratt
robcp@msn.com
Ft Worden Kitemaker conference web site: www.kitemakers.org

[KiteSquid]

I noticed on my kites that I make in the winter verses the ones I make in the summer are not as strong.

I do Iron them but as Sam said the ambent temp of the room affects the speed at which the adhesive "Wets-Out" into the fabric. BTW, Sam is the EXPERT in using this adhesive....

I also try to use Icarex PC as it is impregnated with Polycarbonate and seems to have a stonger bond, but I have not tested it...

There was an article about using 3M's F9460PC in an issue of KiteLines but I don't have it here at work nor can I find it in Steve's Tech Sheets web page... Hint, hint...Steve...

I will look for the article when I get home...

I store my tapes in plastic bags to keep contamination off them...

The backer of the tape is imprenated with Silcone... so the adhesive will not stick to slicone, so if your fabric is impregnated with silcone you will have problems. Also some hosehold products contain silcone..... Keep them away from your fabrics and adhesives!!!!!!
_________________
VR/
KiteSquid
AKA TakoIka
AKA Harold
King George VA


P.S. Yet another post by the Squid..... Doesent he ever shut up???

P.P.S. The wind is like the air, only pushier.

[woodpekr]

Thanks everyone. My kite cave is one of the cooler rooms in the house. I'll set ithe bond with an iron.
--Rich
_________________
Rich Durant
Portland, Oregon

[KiteSquid]

I use an iron like this one that cost me about $12:



But this one has a beter temp control



Click HERE for details.

About $28 at discount hobby shops.... i.e. Tower Hobbies
_________________
VR/
KiteSquid
AKA TakoIka
AKA Harold
King George VA


P.S. Yet another post by the Squid..... Doesent he ever shut up???

P.P.S. The wind is like the air, only pushier.

[stevef]

[dpb]

You might ask Dick Coran if you can have permission to reprint it. Copyrights are odd things. Sometimes a magazine will pay for the right to publish an article/artwork and that article/artwork remains the property of the original author/artist. Other times a magazine purchases an article/artwork for printing, and then it is the property of the magazine. So it all depends on who owns the copyright.

There is also the right of reasonable reference. It is considered permissable to quote an article or book. Up to a point it is considered appropriate referencing. After that point it is considered plagerism or republishing. There are actual legal limits as to how much is reasonable use from books, mags, newspapers and etc (there was a point where I actually knew those limits as they were comunicated by a University professor in his lectures to keep our research papers "legal". It has been much too long though, and now all I remember is that such legal limits exist.).

Dave
_________________
Cherry Blossoms fall like rain,
A lively kite steals the sky,
Paradise in a moment.